Have We Been Lied to About Bread?

In this episode, we sit down with Sue Becker, founder of Bread Beckers, for a conversation that goes far beyond bread.

Sue has spent decades helping families rediscover the power of freshly milled whole grains, challenging the narrative that bread is the problem and inviting us to reconsider what’s actually happened to our food system. Together, we explore how modern processing stripped nutrients from one of the most foundational foods in human history—and how returning to real bread can transform not just physical health, but our relationship with the kitchen, our homes, and even our faith.

We talk about:

1. How conventional flour is devoid of nutrients and the health ramifications that ensued after those vital nutrients were removed
2. The difference between processed flour and freshly milled whole grain
3. Why many people tolerate real bread beautifully - even those with gluten sensitivities
4. Why real bread has absolutely changed Jaclyn's life and the lives of so many others
5. The biblical and historical significance of bread
6. Why reclaiming traditional food practices is both nourishing and quietly radical

This episode is about more than nutrition. It’s about legacy. It’s about slowing down. It’s about remembering what our bodies were designed for.

If you’ve ever felt confused about bread, curious about milling your own grain, or hungry for a more intentional way of living, this conversation will both educate and inspire you.

GET IN TOUCH WITH SUE:

Charity Site: https://www.realbreadoutreach.com
Facebook: Sue Becker
Instagram: suebreadbeckers
Youtube: Bread Beckers
Apple Podcast: Sue's Healthy Minutes with Sue Becker

Chapters

• 0:01 Meet Sue Becker & Her Mission
• 2:06 Why Freshly Milled Flour Changes Everything
• 6:30 First Bakes, Family Reactions, Immediate Benefits
• 12:40 Energy, Cravings, Allergies, And Everyday Health
• 18:10 Testimonies That Sparked A Movement
• 25:45 Nutrients In Grain And What White Flour Removes
• 34:20 Strong Babies, Skin, Nails: Vitamin E’s Role
• 40:00 Satiety, Weight Fears, And Real Bread Myths
• 47:10 Bread, Scripture, And The Idea Of Daily Bread
• 53:20 History Of Milling, Enrichment, And Bleaching
• 1:02:30 What Gluten Really Is And Digestion Basics
• 1:10:30 Antacids, Enzymes, And Misread “Gluten” Issues
• 1:16:50 Sponsors: The Freak App & Ancestral Supplements
• 1:20:00 How Much Bread And How Often

Transcript

Jaclyn: 0:01

Today on the podcast, we have Sue Becker. I just finished my conversation with her, and it is one that you definitely do not want to miss. She is so full of wisdom and grace. She is the founder of Bread Beckers, and she has been a pioneer in helping families return to real bread. That is freshly milled bread, the way that it was supposed to be made from the beginning. She has done incredible charity work. She has given all kinds of incredible classes on the benefits of freshly milled bread. And she is revolutionizing the way people look at wheat. You do not want to miss this. Especially, especially, especially if you have any health issues, autoimmune issues, if you've been told you are not supposed to consume gluten. Listen to this episode. She shares her stories, stories of people that have shared their uh testimonies with her. I share some of the benefits that have I've experienced eating freshly milled bread. And I am so, so, so, so, so excited and delighted to introduce you guys to Sue Becker. I am so excited because today I have Sue Becker on the podcast. Sue, you don't know this, but I have been following you now for about a year. I first heard you on Culture Apothecary.

Sue: 1:30

Yes.

Jaclyn: 1:31

And I feel like I'm already gonna start crying because you changed my life.

Sue: 1:37

Oh my goodness.

Jaclyn: 1:38

You seriously changed my life because you taught me that I could trust bread again.

Sue: 1:44

Yes. Hallelujah.

Jaclyn: 1:46

Hallelujah, right? Yes. I have been freshly milling flour for almost a year now, making my own bread. I had a baby in July. So for the last trimester of my pregnancy, I was eating this amazing bread that you turned me on to. And if you would, would you tell us why you fell in love with freshly milled flour and why it is so different than the flour we see on the shelves in the grocery store?

Sue: 2:21

Oh, yes, I will tell you that. So um I've always loved studying the human body. In fact, I graduated high school, went off to college um as a pre-med student because I love the body, everything about it, and I wanted to save the world, you know? So got to got to the University of Georgia and went, I don't really want to be in school that long. But anyway, I'm gonna make this short. But um, but so I ended up in food science, up and coming industry at the time, but it's the study of food processing. Interesting. But all my biochemistry, physiology, that was still the love of my life. And I focused more on microbiology and I worked for um a major food company as a bacteriologist for almost five years until I had my first child. So um anyway, but after graduation, I just continued to study, and um, and I kind of came at everything from the standpoint that if something's not working in my body, then I must be missing a nutrient. That was kind of the biochemistry scientist behind, you know, behind thought behind it. Kind of simplistic, but I still think it's a very good jumping off place. So I studied and I would most of the things in the 70s and 80s was more about supplementation, but I would always read that whole wheat flour was better. Okay. But I would try the whole wheat flour from the store, and um, it was when I'd make bread with it or muffins or pancakes, it was dry and gritty and just really didn't taste very well. So um I loved I loved cooking. I grew up cooking. I'm southern, born and raised, and my mom was a great cook, and I loved cooking. And so, and my husband and I were gardeners. So, with my studies, I believed in real food. We we were a real food family. We ate food from the garden, we ate meat, we ate real vegetables, real potatoes, you know. Um, and that was the way we lived. And I started making my bread, reading that whole wheat flour was better. I would buy the whole wheat flour from the store. But when I would try to, like I said, make bread with it, it was kind of nasty and gritty. So I would add white flour to make it palatable. So this was kind of the way I lived. But I kind of gave up doing all whole wheat flour until 1991. In 1991, through a publication that I read, um, it introduced me to the history of white flour. We'll get into that in just a minute. What has been done to our flour by the food companies to make it sit on the shelf forever? That was very eye-opening to me. And but then um a brief discussion of the common diseases that plague America, how it was directly related to our consumption of commercially processed food, most importantly, the bread. This this publication was centered on the bread. This made absolute scientific sense to me. And as a Christian who study God's word, it made biblical sense to me. I knew it was real. But what it introduced me to, it didn't just tell me whole wheat flour is better, whole wheat flour is better. It introduced me to the concept of an in-home grain mill to take the whole grain, which is storable, mill it into flour when I'm ready to use it, and it be freshly milled. Oh my goodness. I was like, I was, I was hooked, kind of like you. I'm like doing this. Totally hooked. And, you know, and it was funny. I'm I'm a pretty passionate person. You can probably figure that out. But um, you know, when I read the information, you know, my first thought was, how did I miss this? How did I not know this with all my studies? How did I miss this? And um, but the other thing was I assumed this freshly milled flour was going to taste like the whole wheat flour that I was buying in the store. I didn't realize that it wasn't really what we think it is. So, but I did I didn't care. I was like, we're never eating white flour again. If I have to choke this bread down, we're eating it because what I learned was grains are the most nutrient-dense food God has given us. And even though we were eating real food, real fruit, real vegetables, you know, homemade everything and and eating real, we still had our share of sicknesses. So, um, you know, which kind of puzzled me too. So, anyway, after reading this publication, I was sold. I was like, we're never eating white flour again. We have to choke it down, we're eating it. So, my husband, because of my talking and passion, he he bought me a grain mill way back in 1991. I look back now, it's been 35 years. 1991, he bought me a birth uh a grain mill for my birthday, and um the mill came and I was so excited, and I had found some wheat, and I'm like, I'm gonna I'm gonna make some bread, you know? And uh, so I milled some flour, made some bread, no white flour, no white sugar, just made some bread. It was the most delicious bread that I had ever tasted. That's why I love this.

Jaclyn: 7:16

I know it made real. Yes, and it tastes like you're nourishing your body with the first bite. It's a totally different frequency than a regular bread, completely different.

Sue: 7:28

Even the flour. I mean, when I smell white flour now, even going down the baking aisle, it's there's it's chemicals, and this is just fresh, and it's just it's amazing. It's so oh sorry.

Jaclyn: 7:41

No, no, quick segue. My son loves eating the freshly milled flour plainly. Oh my goodness, and my kids. One of my best friends just sent me a photo of her one and a half year old eating plain flour that she just freshly milled too.

Sue: 7:56

That's crazy. They love the taste, it smells, it just smells so delicious outside of the bread. So for me, I started because of nutrition, and that's and sometimes I get too stuck there. This bread is the most delicious bread I'd ever tasted. The bread came out of the oven. I had five young children at the time when I started. They loved it. It was not bread that I had to coerce or healthy food that I had to coerce my children to eat. I I laugh, and you know, over the years, I think as adults, we'll do most anything to get healthy, you know. And I did all the things the green drinks, the brewer's yeast, the this, the that, you know. And my kids were like, Yeah, I'm not touching that, you know. And even in the midst of all of those things, it did none of them, yes, they maybe gave me more energy or whatever, but none of them did what the bread did. The bread was delicious. It was the most it grains are the most nutrient-dense food God has given us. And I didn't have to coerce my children to eat it. Might have to make them, you know, eat your broccoli. I didn't care anymore. Just eat your bread. I don't care here, you know. And so, and it was delicious. And so now I say, Why do I love this bread? Because it's not only nutritious, it's very delicious. I my husband, I laugh at him sometimes. He says, Um, healthy food have if if it doesn't taste good, it's not good for you. And he's kind of got a point. If you don't like something, you're not gonna eat it. And this was healthy food my whole family loved. We fell in love with it. Then it was health benefits. Oh my goodness. The very first day, I milled flour, I made bread, we ate bread that night, and I get very blunt. I pooped the next morning. It was like, what just happened to me?

Jaclyn: 9:39

Uh-huh.

Sue: 9:40

Um, that ended, and I I laugh and tell everybody, I know you wanted to know this. I haven't been constipated since 1991, and I had struggled with it all my life. I mean, I probably need to come up with a more glamorous way to say it.

Jaclyn: 9:52

But it's but it's true, it's true. The fiber content is it it yes, everything about it nourishes your body.

Sue: 10:02

Exactly, exactly. And so this was and I, and like I said, we were eating real food, we were eating fresh fruits, fresh vegetables, but I still struggled with bowel issues, and this was done, and it has been done. Then I um all these years, 35 years now, and then I began to notice my energy levels. I mean, I had five young children. We homeschooled, we did baseball, we did music lessons, we did church, we did all the things, you know. And um, I even had three children in three years, so I had some young ones there, yeah.

Jaclyn: 10:32

And um, you know, and it's a big tax on your body too.

Sue: 10:35

It is, but I had so much energy, it was noticeably different. My sugar cravings, like I said, we weren't junkie eaters, but it was like, I just want something. All of that went away. Yeah, yes, and I was satisfied. My body was getting the carbohydrates it needed, sustained release because of the fiber, slows digestion. So you get this steady release of those sugars from the carbohydrates that your body uses to make energy. And I just felt full and satisfied. Um, my dependence on antihistamines in the first month went away. I lived on antihistamines, chronic science. My husband, too. Yeah. All of that went away. One of my children's warts went away, and I studied and I knew it was the bread. I have a whole wort testimony. I don't know if we'll get to it. But so, and then I just began to notice over several months, my kids were just that we weren't a sickly, sickly lot, but we certainly had our share of ear infections, snotty noses, viruses, and we're a big family. We go to church, we go to places catching every bug that comes around. Then we all, you know, they're all sick. That ended. And um, I'm not saying they never got sick, but it was very rare. And if they if they did, they got well. And my husband loves for me to tell this in 25 years, we ended up having nine children, um, seven biological, two we adopted.

Jaclyn: 11:56

But in the 25 years of raising our children to doctor visits, that is incredible compared to the average amount of doctor visits most people experience. Maybe two in a week, you know. I mean, that is unheard of in today's environment. And you credit the bread.

Sue: 12:15

Yes, absolutely. I mean, because we were already eating healthy, yeah, but we made this one change. We added real bread made from freshly ground whole grains to what we were already eating. So all the muffins, all the pancakes, the dinner rolls, the sandwiches, everything was made from freshly milled flour. And I knew it was the bread. And so as I saw these changes, drastic changes in my health, I began to study. I'm like, what? Why would I why would it change my sinus congestion? What does that have to do with the fiber cleaning you up, going, um, uh eliminating constipation, having your bowels eliminate the trash every day? You know, a lot of people don't make that connection. Your body's response to toxins and trash overload is you make mucus.

Jaclyn: 13:04

And it reduces inflammation when you get rid of it.

Sue: 13:08

Yes. So it's just, so you know, have you ever wondered why you get a snotty nose when you get a cold? Well, it's because your body's trying to get rid of either the organism or the toxins or whatever. Well, with my trash being taken out every day, I no longer had this overload of toxin response and mucus and sinus congestion. And again, I can say I've not had an antihistamine or a decongestion of any kind since 1991. Even if I do get a cold, I blow my nose and I can breathe. It's it just has never affected me. And all of my children, my two youngest children were conceived and born after bread. They've never had an antihistamine or decongeston a day in their life. And that's pretty amazing considering that children and adults are living on. Yeah.

Jaclyn: 13:52

So common. So so common.

Sue: 13:54

Yeah. So so many things that, you know, and so I became excited, started sharing the bread with other people and um baking bread for other people, taking bread to every function, every potluck, you know, we went to. And I'd send rolls home with everybody. And um, the next thing I know, people are coming to me going, um, my bowels move when I eat this bread, or I feel I have energy or whatever, or I stay full. It's so satisfying. Would you teach me how to make bread? Where can I get a grain mill? And so, um, and then of course, their testimonies led me to study. And then the one that pushed me over the edge was a lady called me early one morning and she said, It's the bread, it's got to be the bread. That was the one, she didn't tell me who she was. And I said, Hello, what's going on? And she said, My cholesterol dropped 85 points in a month, and the only thing I changed was your bread. And um, she said, Um, this was the funny thing. She really, and I was making it for her, she was an older lady. Well, she told all of her friends, the next thing I know, all of her friends are calling me to make bread. And I was honestly, we live in a tiny home, a wall unit, single oven kitchen. And, you know, um, I was making bread all day for people to come and buy my bread, trying to make bread for my family, homeschooling the kids. It's a lot of things. And I I just got weary. I got very, very weary. And I know with everything in me that God put these words in my mouth. And looking back now, it's they were pretty prophetic. But I'll never forget I met my husband in the driveway one day in 1992, as he came home from work, and I just met him and we sat down under the carport, and I said, I don't think I'm supposed to make bread for the world. I think I'm supposed to teach the world to make bread for themselves. My world at that point was four. Four people had asked me when I teach them how to make bread. And now, 32, 35 years later, here we are.

Jaclyn: 15:51

Um you are teaching the world to make bread.

Sue: 15:54

Yes. And it, I just look back and I'm like, Lord, I had no idea what I was saying, but he knew he put those words there. Yeah, and um, and then over these years, these 30 plus years, we have seen thousands of people just like you say this bread, just like that lady, it's the bread, it has to be the bread. She knew it was the bread because multiple medications, multiple doctors, nothing had lowered her cholesterol. And um, and blood cholesterol to high levels is a sign of a significant health issue. Cholesterol is a needed nutrient. So I want to clarify that because people don't understand, but you got to get it out of your blood vessels and to your cells where it's needed. And every nutrient to bring to metabolize cholesterol and break down those fats so they can get to your cells and be used is in bread, is in real whole grains, inocitol, choline, uh, lecithin, vitamin B6, and vitamin E. And all of that was stripped away when they started taking the brand and germ out of the bread and cholesterol. All the nutrients, all the nutrients are are virtually missing. So that sent me on a path. Um, I it's so funny. I am probably more passionate today than I, if that's possible, but it is than I was 35 years ago when I started, because when I hear testimonies, I'm like, how is this possible? And I go, I mean, even yesterday I spent all day reading some scientific studies on bread and different nutrients, and I'm like, I'm so excited, you know? And um, so it's just amazing. I've never seen one food bring such immediate, noticeable health benefits. And I hear it all the time now. And it it's it makes me love bread more and more and more and more. It's it's it's delicious. And what could be better than a piece of warm bread slathered in butter, dipped in, dipped in olive oil. It's your house smells wonderful, and and it's just and it's just so satisfying, not just to eat it, you know. And that's another thing I noticed with with the five children, then, you know, like I said, going on number six, number seven, um, and then adopting two older boys. But people used to say to me, Oh my gosh, you make all your own bread. And um, well, let me back up and tell you this. This was so funny when I first started, you know, I'd take bread or coffee cake or muffins or whatever places everywhere I went, you know, and this was when I first started, it wasn't as well known now as it as it is now.

Jaclyn: 18:27

You've been the pioneer for making it well known. So yes, I know exactly what you're talking about. Nobody was milling their flour back then. It was a dead art. Everybody was buying flour conveniently off the state shelves.

Sue: 18:38

Yeah, if they were even doing that. Most, you know, by that point, people were just buying muffins already made. So I would take things places and people go, Oh my gosh, these are delicious. Can I have your recipe? And I would go, Well, sure, you can have my recipe, but I have to tell you that I mill my own flour to make it. And they would look at me like I had, you know, what plug are you from? But it was so funny. They would always ask me two questions. First question would be, you do what? That would be the first. And I go, I mill my own flour. The next one puzzled me so much. They would say, Where do you live? And I think I think they were picturing a barn with the oxygen. Oh, for sure.

Jaclyn: 19:19

And you just grinding it yourself or something.

Sue: 19:22

They didn't imagine, you know, I've got a little, let's see, it's on this side. The mill here sits on my counter and it grinds as much as I need.

Jaclyn: 19:30

People are doing the same to me. You mill your own flour. What are you talking about?

Sue: 19:35

Yeah.

ADS: 19:41

This episode of The Freq Show is brought to you by The FreqApp your pocket best friend for calibrating your mind and shifting your mindset if you are ready to transform the way you think about yourself and your life then you are definitely going to want to get your hands on the Freqapp It combines uplifting audio messages with specific frequencies designed to reprogram your mindset and transform your thoughts with our custom calibrations that's what we call these audio messages you'll discover how healing your thoughts can reshape your life for the better whether you're seeking stress relief motivation or emotional healing or any array of high frequency emotional states the Freqapp offers tailored support organized by frequency and by activity by frequency for instance we have joy abundance Serenity self-love self-worth by activity we have walking cooking cleaning legs up the wall cold plunging and about 20 other different categories this app is not just about helping you to feel good it's about empowering you to live at the highest frequency daily I created it because I wanted something that would help me shift my mindset easily and quickly whenever I need it the empowering audio messages are amazing if I say so myself, but what really takes them to the next level is the frequency chosen for each message Our bodies are made primarily of water and frequency affects water literally and so when you listen to these messages not only is it helping you reprogram your thoughts by bringing awareness to them it's also shifting the frequency in your physical being we also have incredible plans for the Freqapp we wanna do a sleep series so you can listen to frequency while you sleep and sleep deeper and better we wanna do a breathwork series where we bring in breathwork and teach you how to do breathwork combined with frequency we want to do a series for children helping them understand and deal with their emotions so we have a bunch of calibrations already in the app but our plans for expansion are enormous we have a 5-day free trial you can get it anywhere apps are sold whether that's on the Apple App Store or Android it's available everywhere for a very easy way to download it go to thefreqapp.com and there are links right in there and that's T H E F R E Q A P P.com thefreqapp.com and you can get all of the information there Sam and I have put our hearts and souls into app we cannot wait for you to get your ears and eyes on it and give us all of your feedback. Thank you, thank you, thank you in advance for trying it out. And we hope it will be as transformative for you as it has been for us. Live on purpose and live on frequency.

Sue: 23:02

So, you know, it was just, it was just funny, you know, when I first started. But people love the bread. Um, you know, whole wheat flour gets a bad rap, but people love it. And I love sharing it because when people taste it, they can't believe it.

Jaclyn: 23:17

There we're comparing, though, when people talk about whole wheat bread, normally they're thinking about the whole wheat bread off of a store shelf. That is like comparing a chocolate bar to an apple. It's a totally different comparison. Yeah. Not only the nutrient profile, but the flavor.

Sue: 23:36

Yeah. So yeah.

Jaclyn: 23:38

I have a couple of things to share with you based on listening to your podcast, based on deep diving into your bread class on YouTube. You guys, listeners, look her up on YouTube. I took your bread class, I want to say it's an hour or an hour and a half, where you go through the history of flour and all of the nutrient density. It, I mean, it is a masterclass in why whole grains are so important. But two things came to mind. You mentioned this, I don't know if you mentioned it in your bread class or in one of your podcast episodes, because I've binged a bunch of your podcast episodes too. But yeah, you said we your first babies, I don't remember if it was four or five before you discovered the bread. You gave birth, and their necks were like a baby neck, just not very strong.

Sue: 24:30

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 24:31

And I took note of that. And after I gave birth to my second boy, I didn't know about freshly milled flour with my first son Roman, but after I gave birth to Ephraim, he came out and could hold his head up.

Sue: 24:47

Yes, it was wild.

Jaclyn: 24:52

I mean, every everybody was commenting, like, how is this baby so strong? And I was like, it's the bread. Another story, this is a funny one too. I have a manicurist that I absolutely adore. And after a few months on the bread, she saw me before I ate the bread. Yeah. And then a few months after on the bread, she was taking off my nail polish and she was like, It looks like you have a French manicure. And I was like, I don't.

Sue: 25:21

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 25:21

I was like, it's the bread. It's the bread. My nails, the whites of my nails were so prominent and so strong. It was like these nutrients were infiltrating every cell of my body.

Sue: 25:35

Every cell of your body.

Jaclyn: 25:36

Then third story is I have Hashimoto's. And I know you have publicly shared that you have Hashimoto. And as many women know, when you get pregnant, your thyroid is taxed pretty greatly, right? And so during my pregnancy, I was constantly checking my thyroid. And for the first trimester of my pregnancy, it was a little shaky there. Um, and so I was doing several different things to try and get my numbers in a really comfortable spot. It wasn't horrible, but it wasn't ideal. And we can go into this too. But I was introduced to you about mid-pregnancy.

Sue: 26:17

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 26:18

And you started talking about Hashimoto and how the freshly milled bread was helping you. Yes. And in the back of my mind, I was like, this resonates not only with the way that I feel, but biblically it resonates too. Because God speaks about bread over and over in the Bible, which I want you to touch on too. But I thought, if Bible, if the Bible talks about bread this way, how could it possibly be bad for me?

Sue: 26:50

Yes.

Jaclyn: 26:51

And so I bought the mill, I started making my own bread, and I started trusting the Holy Spirit about what this would do for my body, all the while undoing the narrative of you have Hashimoto's, you can never eat gluten again. Right. Gluten is bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad, bad. So I was undoing this very, very toxic narrative, right? And I got my blood tested. Now, mind you, and I want to be totally honest about this, I had to up my medication a little bit during pregnancy, but still, compared to many Hashimoto's patients, I don't take a lot of medication at all. Right. But after starting the freshly milled flour, my TSH went to one. That's amazing. One while pregnant in my third trimester when your body is taxed to the max. Yep. Yeah. My TSH went down.

Sue: 27:47

That is so great to hear.

Jaclyn: 27:49

Thank you so much for sharing the biblical principles behind it because that is so powerful. Yeah. Sharing the nutrient information behind it because it is so convincing and incredible. And sharing your passion because it truly, Sue, changed my life and changed my family's life because now my boys are growing up on real food. Yes. Yeah.

Sue: 28:17

That's amazing.

Jaclyn: 28:19

Isn't it? It is. It just blows my mind. So yeah. Question for you how much of this bread do you think we should be eating a day to experience the benefits?

Sue: 28:35

Well, I went all in, and um, you know, my short answer is, you know, Jesus compared himself to bread. How much, Jesus, do you need every day, every way, every meal, all the time? And so I don't think about it like that. I I used to actually even get frustrated. I was like, we're so medicine and dosage oriented, you know. But I interviewed someone one day and she goes, Oh no, I take my bread like I would take medicine. I don't miss a dose, you know. So that's another I've I've learned to appreciate that way of looking at it.

Jaclyn: 29:05

I remember that podcast episode. I listened to it.

Sue: 29:07

Yes. So for me, it's like, you know, I mean, this morning I had an egg and a piece of toast for breakfast. Lunch might be a sandwich or a muffin. When my kids were growing up, you know, it was pancakes or coffee cake. We always had some type of bread every meal. Lunch might have been a muffin and some yogurt and fruit, fresh fruit, or it might have been a sandwich. So that was two pieces of bread per child, you know. Dinner might be, and I like to clarify when I say bread, anything from a seed, a grain or a bean. So we might have a pot of brown rice and black-eyed peas with some chicken or you know, potatoes or whatever. We're always gonna have roll, cornbread, something, you know, um, Mexican nights, gonna be a freshly ground um whole grain tortilla. You know, so we were eating probably four to six to maybe even eight or nine servings of bread a day. We were eating it, you know, just every meal. Yeah, I wasn't thinking, oh, I need to go eat my bread. It was just here's bread, you know.

Jaclyn: 30:08

And I'm gonna go eat more because I eat it at at least once a day, you know, sometimes twice. But I think I need to up that.

Sue: 30:17

Yeah. And that's what I've I've done some podcasts with some folks that um, in fact, one gentleman in particular, he said, I listened to your podcast about you saying you eat it every day, every way, every meal. He goes, and I was just eating once, you know, my piece of toast in the morning. He goes, I upped it and he saw significant changes in his blood sugar. I think his cholesterol, I can't remember now all the all the things that he saw, but I I hear this a lot. What I hear is when people the people that share with me the most significant changes in their health, it's they're eating it every meal. It's not just, oh, I've eaten my bread today. And I'll never forget years ago, uh a sweet lady asked me one time, she goes, you know, I'm just not seeing the health benefits that you're seeing. I'm like, are you eating the bread? She goes, Well, yeah, I eat my muffin in the morning. And I'm like, oh not enough, but but also what can affect it too, she she worked outside the home. So she would eat her muffin in the morning, but then throughout the day, she might be having a hamburger with white flour or you know, yeah. So it's counteracting some of those benefits.

Jaclyn: 31:22

Yeah, or white red. White flour is so gluey. Yeah. It's like it, you know, when I think about it like that, I'm like, it clogs your system. Yes. Whereas real bread unclogs the system.

Sue: 31:33

It does. And people don't, I see a lot of times people say, you know, am I undoing, you know, what I'm doing by eating white flour? And I'm like, well, it it depends, you know. It's occasionally, maybe. I mean, I I avoid it a lot. Well, I can say I never eat it, but um not in my home, but maybe out at a party. I might have, but usually I can avoid it.

Jaclyn: 31:55

I don't feel good after I have it. No, and that's sometimes I get a headache.

Sue: 31:59

Yeah, like church will have pizza or something. I'll eat a piece of pizza that I'll come home and I'm like, oh, that wasn't smart. And the next morning I just don't feel well. So it you'll start noticing. So I think you, you know, bread it bread was intended to be the staff of life. It's the most nutrient-dense food that God has given us. Why would we not make it the main part of our meal? In fact, I tell people, my um, my menu planning kind of goes around what kind of bread I want. You know, if I if I want biscuits, I might have cut bread steak. If I want um, you know, tortilla, Mexican, you know, or if I want tortilla, if I want cornbread, then I'm probably gonna have potato soup or vegetable soup. You know, it's just it's just funny. And the other night uh we were having soup for dinner, and I just I was like, I really want cornbread, but I didn't have, I didn't want to take the time, the 35, 45 minutes for corn to make. So I just took and milled corn flour and made my regular pancake recipe and just cooked it like pancakes.

Jaclyn: 32:58

Oh, that sounds amazing!

Sue: 33:00

Oh, it was delicious, it was very, very delicious. And I'm like, oh, this, and and it it was kind of fried and crispy, you know, around the edge. And I'm like, I'm a perfect dipper. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So, you know, that's the thing. Um, you know, I think grain should be the main part of our diet, the main focus, and and bread. I I've seen it too many times. The more you eat, you know, I think the more benefits, the more nutrients you're getting. I mean, you know, when I began to study all this, I I learned that of the 44, 46 essential nutrients that are needed by your body for life and health, there's only four basic ones missing in wheat and some of the other grain supply, though. So vitamin A is not, it's not missing, but it's it's kind of deficient, it's not a great food source of vitamin A. Vitamin C, vitamin um A and C. So, where are you gonna get that? Put your fruits and vegetables in there. Vitamin D comes from the sunshine for the most part, and uh so get outside, and then B12 is not really in any um plant.

Jaclyn: 34:07

That's more dairy and meat, right?

Sue: 34:09

Yes, mm-hmm. So, but look at what's there. Oh, almost everything, almost everything. So, yeah, so it's the most nutrient-dense food group that God has given us, and then not to mention loaded with fiber, loaded with enzymes, loaded with protein. That's another thing people think carbs, carbs, carbs, carbs, but they don't realize that one slice of our bread, we had it tested, five grams of protein in one slice. And here's the most exciting part a hundred percent of your vitamin E need for the day. If you if you go by the minimum daily requirements, which I think those are a little low, but nonetheless, I do too. If we look at that, one slice, grains, wheat in particular, the most um prevalent food source of vitamin E that we have, and if it's freshly milled, and you were talking about your kids' necks, the strength in the next. The reason I knew that and made that connection was because in all my years of studying, after even after graduating college, I read the works of Adele Davis. She was a prominent biochemist in the late 70s. She had a whole chapter on vitamin E. And one of the things that caught my attention is she said, American babies are born with wobbly necks because they don't get enough vitamin E to give them the muscle strength. So didn't think that much about it at the time until my sixth child was born that I conceived and bore after bread. She was, um, I was already doing the bread the whole time that she was born. I mean, the whole time she was in the womb. And at four days old, my husband was reclined slightly, had her laying on his chest, and I saw her crawl up his chest, four days old. My seventh child wild. My seventh child, and she was a stocky little one, very muscular. And so I thought, well, it's just the way she's built, you know, she's just her genetics. My seventh child, not built at all like her, but when she was born, she had swallowed a little bit of meconium. And um, and so they're they're suctioning her out. She's screaming and screaming and screaming. So they wrap her up and they lay her on my chest. Well, they're still working with me, you know, and um after the delivery. And the midwife says to me something, and I answered her. Well, they had laid her, my little set seventh child, Olivia, um, screaming, screaming on my chest. She was kind of face down and I'm reclined. I answer the midwife. As soon as I spoke, yeah, my little one quit crying. She lifted her head from a rolled-down position and turned it up and looked at me. Less than 10 minutes old. And from the very beginning, she never had that wobbly neck. So I wanted to clarify that because people are going, probably going, y'all are crazy wobbly necks, but I've heard it multiple times. People notice it.

Jaclyn: 37:08

It's so true.

Sue: 37:09

And I knew it was the bread because the most nutrient-dense food to give us vitamin E is in the bread. And um, so that was that was funny that you mentioned that. Also, my nails, I never could grow nails growing up, and the next thing I know, I have nails.

Jaclyn: 37:27

So it's it's incredible, you know. I took my, we go to a holistic pediatrician and I took my six-month-old in for a checkup, and my pediatrician looked at me and he said, In my 15 years of practicing, I have never seen a baby this strong. Yeah. Yeah. And Ephraim was holding his, like gripping his hands and allowing him to pull him to standing at five and a half months old. Yeah, it's it's astounding. And he does have good genetic structure. My husband is very strong. Yes. But there's something about this bread that changes things on a molecular level.

Sue: 38:09

Yeah.

Jaclyn: 38:10

I want to speak to this because I'm sure there are some female listeners that are like, if I eat this bread, am I gonna get fat? What's gonna happen? And I want to mention a couple of things. When I was pregnant in my third trimester and I started eating this bread regularly, the inflammation in my face went down, and I noticeably looked thinner while pregnant.

Sue: 38:35

Wow, that's amazing.

Jaclyn: 38:36

I mean, make that make sense, right? But it's the fiber content. And when you talk about vitamin E, vitamin E is essential for all kinds of bodily functions, right? Every cell in your body is great for our skin and makes us look youthful. Yes, yes. So if you want to, I'm I'm not saying like eating bread will make you thin, but what I have noticed is it has not caused me to gain weight.

Sue: 39:04

Right, right.

Jaclyn: 39:05

And I feel like the clarity of my skin is better.

Sue: 39:10

Yes, I agree. I mean, you have beautiful skin, indeed. Um, but and every now and then I'll hear people say, Oh, you know, I've started doing this and now I've gained weight. More people tell me, I just had someone the other day, my wife lost 37 pounds in the last two years of doing the bread. That's what we hear more, or it didn't make me gain weight at all. Every now and then, um, you know, and there's a lot of issues with weight. I'm a little heavier than I'd like to be, and I can breathe and gain five pounds, you know. I just had a baby, I get it. I'm six months in, and I'm still not back to where I want to be. I'm about to be 71. So I just am like metabolism has a lot to do with it. You know, I never really had issues until I turned 60, and then it was just like, okay. So anyway, but it it certainly um it fills you up. And I think growing up, my children were very thin and they ate a lot. We did not skimp at meals, they ate. Now, one thing I will say, um, I think I was about to say this when I went off on another tangent, but people used to say to me, gosh, you must spend all your time in the kitchen cooking food and making bread. And I was like, you know what? I actually spend less time, or there's less commotion going on in my kitchen after bread because my kids would eat breakfast and um before bread, they would eat breakfast. The next thing I know, they're in there looking for a snack, an apple or something, you know, in the kitchen, the teenagers, especially. After bread, we would eat breakfast, and then no one would think about eating till like, and we ate early 7:30, 8 o'clock. No one would think about eating until two. Everybody was full. My son is the same way.

Jaclyn: 40:53

I have to remind him to eat. I'm like, Are you hungry? You just turned four. You're you're little, you should be eating all the time. And he's not. He wants his avocado toast when he wakes up. Yeah. And then he's like, good for a long time.

Sue: 41:06

A long time. And that's what I noticed too with my babies, my sixth and seventh child after bread. Once they started eating the bread, they were satisfied. They would go four and five and six hours, you know, because they would eat and they never snack. I never took goldfish, I never took Cheerios, I never took anything because they never snack. And um, so that's something that's so important that people don't realize real bread because of the fiber and the nutrients. The fiber fills you up, the nutrients satisfy you. And I think a lot of people don't realize why we crave food is because we're we're missing a nutrient that our body needs, but the bread is supplying most everything, most everything. Um, and so eat some meat, eat some fruits and vegetables, get out in the sunshine, drink some real meat, eat real bread. Yeah. Eat real food. That's what I noticed. So I just want to encourage people to not buy into that lie because it is a lie of the enemy or whoever you want to say.

Jaclyn: 42:04

I think it's a lie of the enemy.

Sue: 42:06

The bread in the store makes you fat. It because think of the the bread, not just the loaves of bread, but the twinkies, the donuts, the cinnamon rolls, the muffins. They're not satisfying and they're heavily sugared, there's no fiber there, so you can eat two or three or four or five, you know. And you're still not, yeah, you're not satiety, satiated. No, not at all. I'll never forget this lady called one time and she goes, I'm gonna get so fat on this bread. Um, she had come, and that's when our we did have a bakery at one time, and she had bought a loaf of our cinnamon raisin bread. And she said, I ate five pieces of bread on the way home, half the loaf. And I said, and she goes, I'm gonna get so fat. And I'm like, Well, let me ask you a question. Did you eat dinner? And she goes, No, I was so full from the bread. And I'm like, Bingo, I bet you those five slices of bread had more nutrition, more fiber, less calories than a full meal that you would have eaten. You were satisfied, and you you aren't gonna overeat. And and like I said, I didn't crave sugary things. Um, my kids didn't, you won't you'll find you don't snack, you just it's just satisfying. And um, yeah.

Jaclyn: 43:12

So well, and what you just said reminded me, and it's gonna be a little hard for me to articulate because it's so deep, but Jesus satisfies, yes, and it he created bread and he calls himself the bread of life. So that correlation between that total satisfaction from eating this real nutrient-dense bread reminds me of the beauty of being in relationship with Jesus Christ and how satisfying, wholly satisfying that is.

Sue: 43:47

Yes, absolutely. That's like John 6 35. He says, I am the real bread of life. He who comes to me shall be satisfied. And they knew exactly. What he was talking about. They knew that the bread they were eating satisfied, they could live on it. They knew that. And it's just so powerful, you know, when you see God gave us grains, the most nutrient-dense food they that we he's given us. Grains are storable, so they don't have to be radiated to be stored. They're not picked early and then ripened in a truck and chemical, you know, sprayed with chemicals and all of that. Um they're they're perfectly storable. They store all their nutritional value, but only when they're freshly milled do they retain all of that nutritional value. Do we get all of that from them? And you can you can trace the health decline of America when white bread and white flour came on the scene in the late 1800s. Um, they realized that to keep flours from spoiling, which most of us don't realize real flour spoils because it has fats and oils in the grain, in the germ. And um, to keep flour from spoiling, they started, they invented um mills that would sift, crush the grain, mill the flour, sift the brand and germ away, leaving us only protein and starch, which is what white flour is, the endosperm. And when that happened, diseases became epidemic, epidemic at the time. And um uh berry berry, which is a nervous disorder, it's a B1, vitamin B1 deficiency, pallagra is GI disturbances, skin issues. You talked about your skin, mental insanity, mental issues and anemia became epidemic. No cases of berry berry had been seen. And now all of a sudden, they're seeing these. 30,000 cases of berry berry in one in the very first year that it was diagnosed. They traced it to the missing B vitamins and iron when they took the Brannon germ out of the flower. They urged the millers to put it back in when they finally figured it out. The millers are going, nope, can't happen. We're selling um the Brannon germ to the cattle feed industry. Got it. We're not willing to give up that very lucrative. Yeah. So, you know, and this was very interesting because this was all happening by like 1902, I think was the first case of Pallagra, 30,000 cases. And that's interesting. I'm from Georgia, and it was the first case was diagnosed in Atlanta, Georgia. So this was significant. We're not talking about a case here, a case there, and then anemia, they hadn't seen it. So this is all happening in the early 1900s. And I just read this in the last couple of weeks. You know what instigated the government to step in and mandate that the flower be enriched? It wasn't just that the normal people were they were seeing all these diseases because it didn't happen until 1941. The government stepped in and said, You've got to do something because they were observing the nutritional deficiencies of all the military recruits that they were about to send to war. So when they really started looking at it, full body chills, me too, because I had always read it was mandated in in 1948, but it was really mandated in 1941. And interestingly enough, along that same note, other countries like England, um, because supply lines were um cut off and they couldn't get grain in, they started um mandating that you couldn't sift the bran and germ away because when you take the bran and germ out, you lose about 25% of the flour. So 100%, yeah, it's a huge amount. So they said, you can't, you know, we can't give up, we can't throw away that much food. So the health of the people drastically increased. Diabetes went down, chronic, you know, issues during wartime because they went back to eating the Brandon Germ, leaving it in the flour. It was actually outlawed. You cannot um take it away. In America, of course, they just said mandated that it be enriched. And here's what was so eye-opening to me as a food scientist. You know, I'm in the food industry. When I read enriched, I thought we were making it better than we would have than it would have been had we not put these extra vitamins and things in. That's not what I saw in 1991. When I read that information, it's a mere fraction of the nutrients that they put back in for the plethora that are lost when they're gonna be able to do it.

Jaclyn: 48:17

And aren't they synthetic too?

Sue: 48:19

Yes, synthetic. It was 3B vitamins and iron.

Jaclyn: 48:22

Your body doesn't absorb them the same way.

Sue: 48:24

No, it's and it would take 50 years, 1998, when they mandated that they put folic acid back in to stop because of the rising incidence of birth defects. But now we're learning this synthetic folic acid is causing all kinds of health issues. Then they then we got to bleach it. You know, we can't have yellow flour, it's got to be whiter than white. A product called nitrogen trichloride was used for almost 40 years until they discovered it causes seizures in dogs and hyperactivity, so it might not be good for people, and so they they banned its use, but then a chlorine derivative is still being used today, along with benzoyl peroxide that's been known to liver.

Jaclyn: 49:07

These sound like cleaning supplies, not food ingredients.

Sue: 49:10

I know. When I shared this, um, we've built now our ministry, Real Bread Outreach, we've built bakeries in Haiti and Tanzania and and different places um to help the food and starvation issue and improve the nutrition. And so we had been working with this one orphanage, and I had trained a group of young men to make bread, and they were getting up every morning, these high school boys making bread, five, six, seven, eight hundred rolls sometimes to feed the school children and the orphanage.

Jaclyn: 49:39

Beautiful.

Sue: 49:39

It was wonderful. So they decided one of my trips there, they said, you know, we want you to come and give the nutritional information to the nannies and the workers so they'll understand why we're doing this. So I did, I will never forget their face when I said um two things. First, I shared that the brand and germ is sifted away and it's sold to the cattle feed industry. And I said, and it's still being done today. And I said, I even saw a bag in your market of bran. And when I asked the young man that was taking me shopping what that was being sold for, and he goes, Oh, well, that's pig feed. When I told them that, I mean, they went crazy. They're like, now we know why the pigs are fat and we're starving, you know. But then when I got to the bleaching part, they all knew they bleached their clothes, they bleached the, you know, the kitchen, they bleach the floors to keep it clean. They're like, What? We never want to eat white bread again. This is terrible. We feel like we're eating those cleaning products. So it's it's pretty crazy when you think about it. So, um, so yep, these synthetic vitamins, you know, and supposedly they stopped berry berry and pellagra and anemia. But I always ask Pallagra, like I said, berry berry is um neurological and nervous disorders. How many do we have in this country? It's chronic. Pallagra, pellagra is known as the disease of the of the four D's, dermatitis, so all kinds of skin issues, dysentery, all kinds of GI disturbances and bowel issues, mental issues, uh, dementia isn't that interesting. Death is the last one. And I mean, the death rate in Georgia and South Carolina from plagua was overwhelming. And the mental institutions, um, one article I read in the early days, it said the mental institutions in Georgia and South Carolina were literally overflowing. They did not have enough beds to house the patients, dying of pallagra. How many nervous disorders do we have in our country today? Skin problems, countless, GI Mystery, autoimmune disorders, dementia, nerve. I mean, mental insanity.

Jaclyn: 51:54

So many people are saying, get off gluten, get off gluten, get off gluten. But it's gluten is not the problem, it's the type of gluten.

Sue: 52:02

Well, it's more the what's the the processing. So when they sift the Brandon germ away, the white flour portion is known as the endosperm, that is protein and starch. All gluten is, and this is what people need to know what gluten really is. So in wheat, the wheat family of grains, there are two unique proteins that are found there, not in any other family of grains. It's called glutenin and gliadin. When wheat flour is hydrated wet, so mix up some wheat flour with some water, form a dough, let it sit. When it's fully hydrated, those two unique proteins to the wheat family form this stretchy substance known as gluten. That's all gluten is. And it's important, and it's those two proteins that make the wheat family of grains the king of bread making, because that's those stretchy strands of protein, as the yeast, um, whether it's sourdough or commercial yeast, it doesn't matter, as it feeds on the carbohydrates in wheat, it produces carbon dioxide gas, and it's those stretchy strands of proteins that are able to trap that gas, and that's what enables the bread to rise. So gluten is not a bad guy. Gluten is what makes bread. It's a miracle. Now, here's the problem: when you take the Brandon germ away, you're basically eating those gluten-forming proteins and starch. God never intended us to eat it without the vitamins, without the minerals, without the fiber, without the enzymes. And the fiber is most important because that keeps the pipes clean. White flour, like we've talked about, that hand that has those gluten-forming proteins, is um constipating. And so you're not moving your bowels. And if you don't get clean from, you know, and have the the scrubby sponge, I call it the scrubby sponge of the fiber to clean the villi, then it's gonna lay those down, and then you're gonna have all sorts of issues. Not to mention the fact this is something I've learned in the last five or six years. Well, I mean, I always knew it, but I I really made the connection. Gluten is what? It's two proteins. Okay, that's all it is. It's it's not something someone put in there. God put those in there genetically, and what determines the protein content in wheat is um not so much the genetics, um, but rainfall during the growing season. So to say that wheat has been hybridized or um genetically modified, it has not been genetically modified. It's been crossed with other wheat varieties, so that's hybridization, has not been bred to have a higher protein content because what determines protein content more than anything is rainfall during the growing season. So your hard wheat, your yeast bread making wheat grows in those colder, drier climates in our United States. Here in the south, where I'm from, we can't grow that wheat. Our wheat is called soft wheat because we have a higher rainfall and warmer climate. Our wheat is what's known as soft wheat or pastry flour. It's good for guess what? What southerners are known for cakes, pies, cookies, and what kind of bread? Biscuits. Biscuits, yes, exactly.

Jaclyn: 55:24

My husband's from Georgia and we lived in Georgia for six years.

Sue: 55:27

So, you know, and so that's what people have to understand. And what's really important too is um, and I won't get too deep here, but it's important for people to understand proteins are digested. So carbohydrate digestion begins in your mouth when you eat food, chew it up, you have an enzyme called amylase. So the carbohydrates right away start getting broken down. Then you swallow that food. For all practical purposes, carbohydrate digestion stops because protein digestion begins. Protein digestive enzymes have to have an acid environment to be to work. So your stomach, God created us with these acid-producing cells, mucus-producing cells to protect our stomach lining from not getting eaten up by the acid because it'll drop the pH down as low as one, which is could eat a hole in this countertop, you know. So those protein digestive enzymes start working, the protein is digested, then it gets shunted over into the small intestines where it gets alkalized, then that are digestive juices because the small intestine doesn't have that protection. Also, the digestive enzymes that then pick back up and start finishing the carbohydrate and the fat digestion and all of that, it takes a more alkaline environment. But here's the point I want to make and what people are not understanding. Do you know what one of the number one after laxatives, then another number one um prescribed drug or medication?

Jaclyn: 57:00

Anna acids.

Sue: 57:01

You've got it.

ADS: 57:08

Today's episode of The Freq Show is supported by Ancestral Supplements. with Ancestral Supplements you can now add back the dense nutrition the human body craves to optimally support a vibrant life and experience improvements in energy, immunity, strength, gut and digestion, endurance, memory, vitality, sleep, and much much more. One of the most dense sources of nutrition on the planet their beef liver supplements aid the liver in optimizing the body's metabolic functions helps to detoxify the body and is integral to supporting a healthy immune system if you don't know where to start with Ancestral Supplements because they do have a large library of supplements I would say start with the liver. I would also say they have a free consultation that you can take advantage of, and I would highly recommend that you do. I have emailed them multiple times, and they have helped me tailor a supplement plan specific for my needs and health goals. ancestral supplements, Ultra high-quality liver formula is loaded with vitamins, minerals, proteins, and healthy fats that support collagen synthesis, think skin, hair, and connective tissues, immune health, heart, brain, and liver health. our early ancestors knew this which is why their traditional diets included the frequent and nourishing consumption of this nutritional powerhouse, just the liver supplement provides powerful energy, vibrant skin, fertility, and fetal development, strong bones, brain power, robust, immunity, strength, and endurance eye, and vision health, methylation, and detoxification. it's amazing right so amazing Ancestral Supplements has generously offered our freak community 10% off of your first purchase with code BECKON10 again that's code BECKON10 B E C K O N 10 at ancestralsupplements.com for 10% off your first purchase, I know you are going to love this supplement company as much as Sam and I do have my mom on the supplements I occasionally open the capsules and sneaks some of the nutrition into my son's food it is just next level supplementation. All right. Thank you. Enjoy. And now back to the show.

Sue: 59:43

So we're alkalizing our stomach acid. What is that going to do to it? What is that doing to our protein digestion? It's compromising it. So yeah, you're having trouble digesting gluten. Maybe, maybe it's not the gluten, maybe it's the other other issues. And um, and and you know, and the technical definition of an allergy, the the nutritional definition of an allergy is an adverse reaction to a protein component in a food. Intolerances can be other components like a lactose intolerance or something like that. But a true allergy, they consider it a protein component that you can't break down. Isn't that interesting? So when I put that piece of the puzzle in there, I was like, this is interesting. This is this, yeah, and all these people with acid reflux, it's not a low, it's not a too much acid issue. It's a too little acid issue. So now you're taking an antacid. Yeah, it might be it's making it worse. Exactly. Because you have a you have a muscle, there's a flap that that um blocks the stomach acid from coming back up into your esophagus. Do you know what stimulates it to close? A very acid environment, a very low pH. So you are not correcting the problem, you're actually magnifying the problem. Yes, it may alkalize it enough that it doesn't burn when it comes up, but you haven't corrected the problem. We have so many people start drinking kefir, get some acid in there, get some digestive enzymes in there, and it ends that. But so it's really fascinating. And I had a lady write me that they found polyps in her uh stomach and her esophagus. She asked the doctor, and he goes, Oh, that's a side effect of the antacids. Don't worry about it. It's okay.

Jaclyn: 1:01:41

And she's like, No, I don't know, not okay.

Sue: 1:01:46

No, you know, I I'd love to read a quote if I can. Yeah, of course. This this blew me away. And this is a well-known doctor, but I just wanna I want to encourage people to think biblically and logically. Let's use our minds. So here's his quote: this is what he says Damage to the gastrointestinal tract from the overuse of antibiotics. My children only needed antibiotics three times in 25 years.

Jaclyn: 1:02:15

Nine children. Yeah.

Sue: 1:02:17

Yeah. Anti-inflammatory drugs like Advil or Aleve. How many people are living on that? Chronic. Ready? Acid blocking drugs like prile second nexium, combined with our low fiber, high sugar diet, leads to the development of celiac disease and gluten intolerance or sensitivity and the resultant inflammation. Well-known doctor says that. I totally agree. Here's the problem I have. Listen to his conclusion. That is why the elimination of gluten and food allergens or sensitivities can be a powerful way to prevent and reverse this and many other chronic diseases. Hold on. I did not hear gluten mentioned in the lineup of things that caused the problem. How about we introduce real bread and then we don't need antibiotics, we don't need anti-inflammatory drugs, we don't need acid blocking drugs. We're eating a high fiber, low sugar diet. Do you and then he goes on the next paragraph? The biggest problem is wheat.

Jaclyn: 1:03:27

No, no, maybe store-bought shelf wheat, but we aren't eating the store-bought shelf wheat. It's a totally different thing. Again, it's like chocolate bars and apples. You're not comparing the same thing.

Sue: 1:03:38

Well, it's like I actually came up with the analogy. It's like um paper and a tree.

Jaclyn: 1:03:43

Yeah.

Sue: 1:03:44

Would you say that this is a tree? No, you would not. Well, that stuff in the store is not wheat, and that's the problem. That stuff in the store is giving wheat a bad name and a bad reputation. And people, even educated health professionals, they're not differentiating, they're not seeing the difference. They're saying wheat is inflammatory. No, that stuff is. Wheat is not, you know, wheat makes you fat. No, it doesn't. In fact, prior to the 1900s, the national average of wheat consumption per person was 235 pounds per person per year.

Jaclyn: 1:04:23

That is a lot of wheat.

Sue: 1:04:26

Yes. That is a lot of wheat. And see people say, oh, the obesity and health has increased has as wheat consumption has increased. Wheat consumption is less than half now. You know what has changed prior to the 1900s, 90% of the flour produced in this country was used at home. Today it's less than 10%. We're buying, buying.

Jaclyn: 1:04:50

I know, I know we just inverted the food pyramid, but I feel like and in some ways, I think that's fabulous. Yes. But where they're getting it wrong is the wheat. Because, but at the same time, most of America is thinking of wheat as the stuff you buy in the grocery store. We're talking about a totally different animal, but we need to get you with RFK and give him some education.

Sue: 1:05:14

No, I'm hoping. I'm hoping.

Jaclyn: 1:05:16

If I can help with that in any way, let me know. Well, I want to be so respectful of your time. We're wrapping up on an hour. If you don't mind, I have two more things I want to chat with you about real quick. I want to tell you again, I just want to sing your praises. You have inspired me so much and changed my life, changed my family's life because you helped me to trust bread again. And I've been making my bread now for almost a year.

Sue: 1:05:41

That's amazing.

Jaclyn: 1:05:42

And last fall, I felt God whisper to me a hundred loaves. I want you to give away a hundred loaves. And you are a huge part of that because you helped me understand all of this. And so I started a project called The Hundred Loaves. Project where I'm giving away a hundred loaves of bread, and that is in large part because of you, and I want you to know that.

Sue: 1:06:08

Oh, wow. That's amazing.

Jaclyn: 1:06:09

Next thing is if I can help you in any way with your bread charities or any of those things, please let me know. Oh I am in because I'm all in on this bread.

Sue: 1:06:22

That is so amazing.

Jaclyn: 1:06:23

Last thing is, if people are overwhelmed at the thought of making their own bread, I understand now that it's not that time consuming. You know, I make now I'm making more because I'm giving it away, but I probably make fresh bread once or twice a week. And after a day, I freeze it, put it in the freezer, and then put it in my toaster oven and it tastes fresh. But for the people who feel very intimidated by this process, how would you encourage them to begin so it feels less overwhelming?

Sue: 1:06:55

Well, the thing, um, you know, for me it wasn't overwhelming because I already cooked from scratch. So just buying a get the right tool. Buy a grain mill that's easy to use.

Jaclyn: 1:07:05

And you have them on your website.

Sue: 1:07:07

Yes, we do. I love the wonder mill, particularly because it's it's it's a no-brainer. Turn it on, pour the grain in, it comes out flour and it makes flour fast. So you're not, you know, waiting um for flour to be ground. So I love it. Um, and then start simple. When I first started, I started with four basic recipes. You ready? Pancakes. Stir up with a wire whisk and a bowl. So, you know, and then fry them up, just like the corn pancakes I made the other night. Very big. Be ready. Five minutes, you know. Um, muffins, coffee cake, those are quick breads, those are stir up with a wire whisk and a bowl, baking powder, baking soda, and fun to make with kids.

Jaclyn: 1:07:44

My son is fun to make loves helping me with those. Yes, loves.

Sue: 1:07:48

Yes, mine did too, and my grandkids like it too. And so start there, and then I found a yeast bread recipe, and I that was what I did. And everything was made with that one basic recipe. You don't need a lot of recipes. My muffin recipe, um, my son just taught a class in here today, right before we started. And you should see there's some lemon, raspberry, chocolate chip, there's some banana muffins, there's blueberry muffins, all from all from the same muffin recipe. Just change it up. And and like I said, the pancakes, you know, normally we think of them sweet. The other night I was like, why can't I just use corn flour and make corn pancakes? And they'll and they tasted just like cornbread. So get some basic recipes. I love my basic muffin, basic pancake, um, coffee cake. We have um little red book that was my beginning book, and then my big essential homegrown flour book. Those are great starting places. And then the bread dough, yeast bread dough. I did not grow up learning to make yeast bread. So that was something that I learned even before I milled. I started making yeast breads. And then just use that dough. I make cinnamon rolls out of that same dough. I make donuts out of that same dough, sandwich buns, hamburger buns, garlic rolls, you know, make them savory, dip them in butter. Versatile, it is, and just just start simple. And people would ask me, Do you have a rye bread recipe? And I go, Nope. Do you have this? Nope. I have these four. Now, as I've uh over the 30-something years, yes, yeah, you grow up. Grow a lot more recipes, grow with it. Of course, you grow with it. Yeah, but that's what I would encourage people. Start simple, get the right tools. If you're in and out of the house a lot, bread machines are a wonderful option. You can dump the ingredients to the yeast bread in, come back to a baked, I mean, five minutes, dump it in, come back to a baked loaf of bread. And the ones that we carry, the Zoharushi, you can even set it at night and wake up to hot bread in the morning, or set it in the morning before you walk out.

Jaclyn: 1:09:45

I'm gonna have to invest in one of those because I do the cast iron in my oven and I love it. But you know, it's well, you know, and it you have to watch it a little closer.

Sue: 1:09:53

Yeah, you it depends because now when my kids were all at home, I made six loaves of bread twice a week. I had a I had a big mixer that I love, the Anchor Shroom mixer. So that was wonderful. But I'd take that, I'd make a big batch of dough. I'd take that dough, I'd make some loaves, some hamburger buns or dinner rolls, and then some cinnamon raisin bread or something, all out of the same dough. I had three days, breakfast, lunch, and dinner type breads ready, you know, in a couple of hours. It's not a lot of it's not a lot of hands-on by the right tools. I know it's an investment, but I'm telling you, an investment in your health, though. Uh, two doctor visits in 25 years, how much money has that saved me? No Advil or leave, no antibiotic. How much has that saved us?

Jaclyn: 1:10:38

And just the way you've got to thousands and thousands and thousands of dollars.

Sue: 1:10:42

Yeah, it'd be it's very difficult to put a price on it. So I know it's an investment. And hey, I started when I had five young children. So I feel you, I feel you. Some days yeast bread didn't happen, and some days it was like, oh, we don't have any bread. Oops, we're making muffins for lunch. Oh, I didn't get bread made. Oh, we're having muffins for dinner, you know. So you can do it. And I'm just, you know, and boil grains and eat them. People have forgotten that you can boil grains and and you can do that in a slow cooker too, can't you?

Jaclyn: 1:11:12

Yes, you can.

Sue: 1:11:14

Yep, and grits and cream of wheat, those you can grind in a blender, coarse grind, you know, the um corn or wheat to make cream of wheat. The mills that we love the wonder mill, it makes flour, but it makes it fast and it makes you know 12 cups at a time if you want that if you need that much. That's amazing. But I mean, and you can have the flour milled before you get your other ingredients ready almost.

Jaclyn: 1:11:38

So it's oh, I do, I totally do, and I've experimented with sourdough. I love sourdough. I do too. Yeah, the starter and stuff is a little bit more labor intensive. So when I first started, I was just doing the yeast spread too. And it's so fast, it was like it is, it's it wasn't that big of a deal at all. Yeah, do you recommend any kind of particular grain or just a whole grain? Because I use eincorn, I use hard red, I use hard white, I use spelt. I I like having types, yeah.

Sue: 1:12:09

Well, and see, and that's what's so fun to me about this is the sky's the limit, you know. The flavor can change in a recipe. Uh, you can do the same basic bread dough with spelt, with eincorn, with kamut. You don't need a kamut recipe, you don't need a spelt, just use it. Now it may take a little more flour, may take a little less, whatever. So, in the beginning, I started with hard red wheat. And I because that's all I knew. And um, I started with hard red wheat. It was a year or so into it when um hard white wheat has not been around that long. It came out actually in the early 90s. So I was just getting started when hard white wheat kind of came on the scene. So I enjoyed it for things like pizza dough and things like that. Getting started, um, eincorn, I love spelt. Spelt is one of my favorites.

Jaclyn: 1:12:56

Ironcorn and spelt, they're they're my favorite.

Sue: 1:12:59

Little trickier to work with with yeast breads because it's a little lower protein, little weaker gluten structure. So for someone just starting out, I'm gonna say go with our basic getting started is hard red, hard white. And if you know you want cakes, cookies, biscuits, and pies, soft wheat. Yeah, and you know, those are those are my three staples. And then branch out. My favorite combination right now is hard red and kamut. It makes the best bread, about two parts red and one part kamut. Yeah, but I ran out of that. I have a mixture of that already made. And so the other day I was like, huh. So I did a cup of hard white wheat, a cup of um kamut, and a cup of spelt, and just ground that, made great bread. So, and people are probably going, I don't even know what you're talking about. So just keep it simple, branch out as you get your feet wet.

Jaclyn: 1:13:53

Um, but also you're such a great resource because you've got the YouTube class, you've got multiple videos on YouTube, but you've got a whole class about the history of bread and getting started, which I highly recommend. Yeah, your website has a bunch of resources, and then your podcast is also so helpful. So I think you take a lot of the intimidation out and you sell grain as well, right?

Sue: 1:14:18

Yes, we're one of the largest grain suppliers. I don't know, maybe I know in the southeast we have over 150 co-ops.

Jaclyn: 1:14:24

So that's something there's one in Phoenix where I live in Scottsdale, so I know you have one here.

Sue: 1:14:29

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So um just look on our website. If you don't see one, you know, think about starting one or you know, whatever. So we have them all over. So you can go to our website, breadbeckers.com, our YouTube channel. We do have um two videos I know of that are basic list of getting started items where I go over hard red wheat, hard white wheat. This is what you need for yeast bread, soft wheat, you know, buckets. And we package our grain in buckets, which is a little different than a lot of suppliers in the southeast. Well, anywhere, um, the enemies of grain storage are moisture bugs rodents. So when our grain comes in, we package it in um six-gallon food grade buckets with carbon dioxide gas, so that we we guarantee if you'll keep that bucket closed, um, you know, it doesn't matter if you go in and out of it, but keep that lid on when you're not using it, and um, then it should be bug-free and sustainable. You don't have to freeze it or anything like that. That's when you buy things in bags, but we don't sell in bags. And um, so we have um all of that on our website. We also have a separate website for our co-op. So you can go breadbeckerscoop.com, see if there's a co-op near you. We deliver every four months to an area, it's no cost to join. Um, you know that. Yeah, and there's no minimums or you know, anything like that. You're you're ordering and um with a group, so you get uh a discount of volume and stuff like that. But um, so there's co-ops, there's the YouTube channel, my my um podcast, Sue's Healthy Minutes. So much information. Oh my gosh, this week's testimony, the breads, it's the bread story. It made me cry. You're gonna just absolutely love it. Um listen to that. Yes, a mom with um one little one with seizures and one born with brittle bone disease. It'll take your breath away. Her baby was in utero with two broken femurs, 30 bone breaks in her first three years of life, one year of doing the bread, no bone breaks. Oh I just got chills, even sharing it. I I choked up. You should see me when she started telling the story.

Jaclyn: 1:16:41

I'm like, okay, wait a minute, I'm crying here, but um just the goodness of God, God these grains perfectly created our bodies to process these grains perfectly. And when you remove when we remove God from the equation, yeah, when you remove real bread from the equation, you're missing out on basically everything.

Sue: 1:17:05

Yeah, you know, um, and so that's great. Real bread outreach is our ministry where we help um people get grains, mills, whatever they need to start, if they truly, truly can afford it. And we have some questionnaires in place to see because a lot of people will say they can't, but they can, yeah. Um, but some people can't, really can't, and we yes, and then we have um, you know, we've built a bakery in Haiti and Tanzania, we helped start one in Uganda, we helped a bread ministry in uh Israel, we've sent mills to the missionaries in Japan and the Philippines, and so that's what I'm saying. When God said, when I said we're supposed to teach the world, I had no idea. And you know, I find bread scriptures all throughout, and John 6.35, of course, Jesus comparing himself to bread, Isaiah 55, 2. Why do you spend your money for that which is not bread? But I'm gonna tell you the most powerful one that I think I've I've found was Deuteronomy 24, verse 6. If you can imagine, I never would have thought a bread scripture would be there, but you know, that's the law. So you're you're kind of waiting for it. I know it's yeah. But he he gives such practical laws about how to treat each other, and he has a law for borrowing and lending. In those days, if you borrowed something from somebody, you would leave them with a pledge, something of value that belonged to, you know, of value to you that you would leave with him as a promise, as a pledge. I'm going to pay you back, I will return what I'm borrowing. You hold this as a pledge. God had a law for what you could not take as a pledge. And he said in Deuteronomy 24, verse 6, do not take a man's millstone as a pledge, for you would be taking his life. Wow. God equates to my eyes. It does me too every time I even share it to this day. And I remember where I was when I saw it. I'm like, oh my goodness, this is powerful. But that's exactly what we let happen in the early 1900s. They took our millstones out of our home because prior to them, people ground their own, either at home or the local miller, took it out of our home, and we've been losing our health and our life ever since. But God is bringing us back to his way of living and being and doing and bringing bread back in the house.

Jaclyn: 1:19:34

He is using you so profoundly. You have inspired me immensely. I when you agreed to come on the podcast, I told my husband, and he was like, I know how excited you're gonna be about this because you love her so much. Thank you for being such a tool of the spirit and helping people to understand the beauty and importance of this bread and making it something that they can incorporate in their daily schedules, even with nine children. Megan, you can do it with nine children. You can do it with two. My best friend does it with four. Yeah. We got this. You got it. You got it. Is there anything else you want to say or anything else you want to share as we wrap up? I want to give the floor to you. And just again, thank you immensely for.

Sue: 1:20:26

Oh, you are so welcome. Well, I just um was thinking, you know, this is I just want to encourage you, do it. Don't be intimidated, don't hear what the world is telling you about bread because most of it is not correct. And I've never seen one food bring such immediate, noticeable, drastic, and broad spectrum. Now thousands. Testimonies. I mean, like this woman, her daughter's seizures stopped in the year that they've been doing the bread. Brittle bone disease. Is it going to reverse it? No, but her child is growing and running, and they said she would never walk. So this is amazing. You just can't believe what it might do for your family. And um, I I just can testify it, it changed my whole direction in my life, not just the health of our family, but what God has called us to. And um, I'm I'm so thankful. I'm gonna tear up a little bit, just to just to be able to speak into people's lives and hear testimonies like yours, you know, of changed health. And um, it's it's very, very gratifying, and I'm honored and humbled to be able to be used by God in this way.

Jaclyn: 1:21:44

So thank you. Being used, you are in the best way. It is my pleasure. I'm gonna link everything for people so they know where to find you, where they can buy the grain, where they can get your book, etc. But thank you so much.

Sue: 1:21:58

You are very welcome. Thank you for giving me this opportunity.

Jaclyn: 1:22:01

Oh, it is my joy, truly. Thank you so much for listening to The Freq Show with Sam Thurmond and me, Jaclyn Steele Thurmond. We would love to connect with you via our website, beckonliving.com and on social media.

Sam: 1:22:18

You can find us on Instagram and TikTok @beckonliving, and you can join our email list to receive uplifting messages, podcast and business updates, and discounts on high frequency products just for our freqy community. Cheers to High Frequency Living!